At about 9:30 am on the second day of installation the supervisor rang my doorbell. I had just one question for him: “Is this full-frame replacement?”. His response was, “Yes, because we took out the frame.” I stood there gobsmacked. They did take out the vinyl replacement frame, but that is not the same as full frame replacement, which removes the original frame. And you don’t have to trust me. Read about this from Pella.
When I told him this was to be a full frame replacement, including replacing the exterior trim, he replied, “Well if that is what you want, that would be thousands more!”. His mood was getting hotter, and he let me know he had five crew members standing around. I held my ground and told him not to start until I talked with the salesperson.
When the salesperson arrived about 10:30 am I took him to the inside of one of the newly replaced windows, pointed to it, and asked him, “How is getting full frame replacement different from not getting full frame replacement?” He replied, “Because you got trim, and you know you wanted trim”, pointing to where the interior trim will be placed.
Things were clearly not heading in a positive direction. To better explain myself we went outside to the deck and I pointed to the exposed exterior trim. The salesperson repeatedly told me that is part of the structure of the house, and they can’t take that off.
I pulled out my phone and showed them this video by Pella that is an animation of full frame replacement, and it shows exterior trim being removed. The installation supervisor looked at it for a few seconds then said that is for Hardie board siding. Then he said that no one would ever remove that trim. (Well, if so, the time to say this to me isn’t after you start doing work that is not what I hired you to do. I later checked with one of the other companies that gave me a quote, and their quote was for full frame replacement with new exterior trim. And the cost wasn’t much different.)
The two guys kept telling me over and over that I just don’t understand. Their voices were getting louder and angrier. This kept going on and on as I tried to explain the problems I saw. I eventually realized the work was going to continue whether I liked it or not. They viewed me as simply an impediment. I finally relented.
If you haven’t been in a situation like this, you have no idea how vulnerable a position a homeowner is in—especially when part of their house is being removed— and how violating it is.
When people hear this story, they wonder why I didn’t tell them to leave. I think you would have had to be there to fully understand the situation. With two guys insisting I was wrong and they were right, the situation was completely out of control. I didn’t have another contact at Pella, only the salesperson who was telling me I was wrong. The only choice I saw was to walk away and deal with the problem after they finished. At least they were removing less of my house than they should be, rather than more.
Once the work was starting again I tried to hang around my house, but I felt so ill that I had to get away. I walked about three miles into work, trying to clear my head but still in disbelief of the situation.
I dreaded returning home after that second day of installation. All I could do now was to document what was happening. So I started taking photos of every window, inside and out, everyday to have evidence that might be useful after this was over.
To help document this crazy situation, I wrote an email to the Pella salesperson to confirm this was a full frame replacement job. I received this voicemail confirming it was:
Hey Melissa, it’s [name] with Pella. I hope you are doing well. The easiest way you could explain that to your mom is full frame replacement doesn’t always mean that all the trim gets replaced, even though we did all your trim on the inside was replaced. But full frame means that you are taking out the whole two window sashes and the guts and putting in a new window and new guts. And a pocket fit would mean that we would reuse your existing guts and just replace the sashes. So hopefully that will explain it. Just call me if you have any questions. Thank you and have a wonderful day.
So it seems that the definition of “full frame replacement” is different in Kentucky than elsewhere. And if I hadn’t specified “full frame” apparently they would have installed the new windows into the vinyl frames?
Oh. Good. Lord.
This was supposed to be a project to deal with both the rotten exterior trim and the windows. I am a first-time home owner, but rotten wood seems like it is a problem, at least to me.
If this discrepancy about full frame versus insert replacement was the only problem with the installation, it would be bad. Quite bad. But the rest of what happened is why this turned this into a horror story.